Welcome to the weekend. Hope you have something fun planned to do since spring is in full swing. Oh yeah the Vikings are drafting…sort of.
Minnesota Vikings weekend Discussion – SkolAsylum: 29-30 Apr 2023
Discussion
About The Author
Welcome to the weekend. Hope you have something fun planned to do since spring is in full swing. Oh yeah the Vikings are drafting…sort of.
Have to stop clicking on draft “experts”. Everyone says something different.
Don’t bother. We’ll find out in 2 years how it’s going
Interesting charts…seems the NFCN had two teams making some reaches early.
I’ve seen some bad lies but this is definitely the worst.
Nope… same thing. It showed up for a split second then disappeared again.
What is it and I’ll try to post it.
Mean wife’s swing?
I assure you I do not look like that when I swing a golf club…
See we got a UDFA kicker from Georgia. Jack Podlesny.
182 of 184 extra points.
61 of 74 FG’s.
Maybe.
Well the goal posts are wider in college so that helps. That said, maybe we can finally find a kicker who doesn’t lead the league in missed extra points for once.
Thought same size, have to google.
Here it is:
I just tried posting a video link on the golf swing which I’m very interested in trying. When I tried posting, it showed up for a second, then disappeared. Probably needs a mod to approve it or something. Dunno. I’ll try and post it again and see what happens.
No comments are pending, it’s showing nothing rejected, either.
Okay, weird. Those comments were filtered as spam. I restored the comments, they should appear now.
Thanks Brad.
So most of you know that I play decent golf, but suffer from a lack of power and distance. For instance, I hit my 5 wood about 170 yards, my 3 wood about 180 yards, and my driver about 200 yards when I “flush” them. I do hit the ball solidly, and pretty much where I’m aiming a lot of the time, which results in not losing many balls or strokes. I have never really hit the golf ball with much authority though.
I found this video yesterday that basically nails the reason for my like of distance. I swing the club with my arms just as this guy highlights. I’m kinda interested in giving his advice a try though and see if I can actually hit the ball the way he prescribes.
Terrible terrible tragedy…
So profoundly sad… this is something you never truly get over. Heartbreaking.
True, never wanted to out live a child, probably ridden with guilt all their lives.
Guess McBride has some good hands. Like to that that element out of backfield more. Will see.
I would say that the ability to pick up the blitz and catch the ball out of the backfield are of equal importance to his running ability. Giving Cousins that extra help makes a big difference.
Could pair with Ham in backfield if line is having problems, which we know they will. Just thinking less developing play and keep KC from getting killed.
Did he play with a fullback in college? Following a fullback “instinctively” isn’t as much a norm anymore. Teams are throwing the ball more, and fullbacks aren’t as plentiful as they used to be.
Saw some clips, didn’t see one. Curious to see him play.
Jordan Addison is here.
Any KC talk today? Bring on OTA’s, What the hell. I will be surprised we finish .500. Sorry.
Here is Jaquelin Roy
This is the one for Jay Ward
Quick little breakdown on Hall if anyone is interested.
What will interest me this preseason and offseason is who’s getting the snaps in the games.
How many more/less with Mullens get than Hall?
Do you mean preseason?
I like Mullens. Hall reminds me a little of Heinicke though. Kind of a feisty competitor but can he make all the big throws under pressure Cousins makes? Maybe… dunno. At least as you say, preseason should be better than the Mond/Mannion days.
Rick is high on Addison… or is he just high Mick?
Eagles drafted every one of these players well below their projected spot.
Jalen Carter
Nolan Smith
Kelee Ringo
Come on man…it’s like the rest of the league is just handing them the talent. If the Vikings had this draft we’d all be over the moon.
Yea, it does seem kind of amazing. Still, think the 49ers will give them all they want. The Eagles are interesting. Wonder how long using your QB as a RB taking on NFL LB’s is going to last.
I tend to agree with this perspective. The Ravens just signed Lamar Jackson to the biggest contract ever and he missed 6 games at the end of the season last year for a leg injury. Kyler Murray has missed time, as well as most other running QB’s. You know who hasn’t missed any games in his career for injury?
So your saying Kirk is due??
Laughing… no, but he sure gets hit a lot so it’s kinda amazing he’s never missed a game for injury.
reading some of your comments – are you from the DC area? ( if you don’t mind answering)
Yes, my family moved to Fairfax Va from Belleville Illinois when I was 5 years old in 1960. I left the area when I went to college, then into the Military but I was a Redskins fan for basically the rest of my life till today.
I spent the last 13 years in the DC area as well.
Nice. I grew up in Bloomington Illinois and then spent decades in the Sterling (next to Redskins Park), Reston and Vienna areas. Although I have always been a Vikings fan, to varying degrees because of distance, I actually know more about the Redskins than any team in the NFL I could tell you know a lot about them from your comments.
Yeah, being a “long suffering” Redskins fan, I do have fond memories of the Gibbs era with the Hogs, Riggo, Art Monk and maybe my favorite Redskin of all time Darrell Green. Remember the Sonny Jurgensen vs Billy Kilmer days under George Allen too. The last 30 years though… whoooof.
Yea – 50 gut left and then 50 gut right. And then came Snyder and the rest is history – not a pretty one.
Yeah… loved the 50 gut calls. Riggo would run over you if there wasn’t much of a hole. He was faster than many folks know too. He was a three-sport athlete, earning high school All-American recognition in football, all-state honors in basketball and twice winning the Class B 100-yard dash state title.
Your from Fairfax There used to be a Holiday Inn bar just off 66 and 123 there in fairfax. Was amazed how many beers Ole Riggo could consume in one setting.
Yep… there were a few Redskins haunts back in the day where you might see guys like Joe Jacoby, George Starke, Dave Butz and others draining more than a few pitchers of beer.
Played golf once with Bostic and Grimm. They had two cases on their cart and ran out before we finished. Great guys and down to earth as heck.
I have total envy… I met Doug Williams here in Tampa about 15 years ago at a BBQ place called Leroy Selmon’s. Had about a 20 minute conversation with him. Great guy.
I met a few Redskins back in the day as well, like Joe Theismann, Larry Brown, Jerry Smith, etc. Never played golf with any of them though. Must have been an awesome day.
Maybe things are different now or I was just lucky. Used to run into Joe Gibbs at Starbucks in Reston (second time). Worked out once in a while with three different Skin QB’s. And if you hit balls, you could always run into several players at Woody’s Range. And will say, all were great guys.
Someone’s been surfing skoloholics for content….
My impression of KAM after two drafts now is kinda “WTF is he doing?”
That’s funny as hell actually.
You’re a gamer Lifer
15 UDFA signed. At 88, 2 to go. Camp meat. Maybe we get lucky.
Heard they were saving those 2 for tryouts ala Thielen/Ham.
I don’t “feel” like we have many hidden gems there, but the Vikings must see something in them, or they wouldn’t have signed them. I assume.
I am rooting for Carter.
6-7. 260 at West Point?
The retired army in me approves.
Thank you for your service. I wonder about Carter. I read in 2021 he played great and had awesome stats. Then in 2022 opposing teams paid a little more attention to him and he wasn’t as productive. We’ll see if over the next couple years he shows growth and becomes a meaningful player.
West Point is pretty intense so he couldn’t concentrate on Football to the extent other schools allow.
Plus West Point/Army have hight/weight standards he had to meet and they don’t take into consideration massive human beings.
If he can get thru WP while playing collage ball I don’t imagine training camp will be too much for him.
Definitely agree, and pulling for him!
LOL…
According to Lifer, the Army is terrible and starves the cadets.
LOL
Lifer: Carter being in the Army had a hard time bulking up 6’5” 250 but now he’ll get the proper training and nutritional guidance. He might be a decent rotational guy.
‘Proper Nutritional Guidance’ for an NFL DE is not the same for an Army Officer.
I have no doubt he is fit, just not bulked up as he could be.
Lol. Ok.
trust you not…..
I tend to agree with this take. Army cadets have a rigorous schedule at West Point as you highlighted. They are not student athletes in the traditional sense. Academics far outweigh athletics. His time in the weight room was probably less than an hour and a half a day. NFL trainers and nutritionists will be a plus for him. He’ll have the opportunity to “be all that he can be” in that regard in the NFL.
And contract adjusted means they would have to agree right? Z wants out so that could happen. Dalvin doesn’t want out we just don’t want to pay him 14 million so what would be his incentive to adjust his contract?
Does he though? Z?
or does he want more money.
Wants guaranteed money
Me too
It’s insulting that we don’t get guaranteed money.
I think they try to work things out with Z.
Cook will be a post June cut
I think the opposite.
Make him show up. Vikes have all the leverage otherwise fine his ass
Would rather see someone 6’4 245 with mad athleticism, but I can wait and see if this 5’10” guy can cover 6’5″ TE’s.
What say you on here? I have a shed that’s not very old but it sits in a spot that just gets blasted with heat and sun in the summer and snow in the winter. The cross wood on the bottom of the doors are starting to warp. I don’t think putting a cost of seal will do the trick. Just curious your guy’s thoughts. Thanks!
I’d sell my house.
Lol, because of a shed?. Makes sense.
Hahaha
I think I would power wash it all and to get the dark stains close to the ground as light as possible. Then I would research the best clear sealer / polyurethane that’s weather / sun resistant and put two or three full coats on it. I like the color of that wood and once you do that it would be a beautiful shed.
Power washing doesn’t help the warp though.
water is in the wood and that’s no bueno.
That’s my thinking too. Thought about power washing but already have water as an issues. The bottom is from this snow this winter was so high it just sat against it.
They don’t look that warped from the pic. You can power wash on a sunny day the wood will dry lol….it’s a shed doesn’t have to be perfect but you’ll be surprised how well it will turn out and the wood will be protected and last.
Kerosene, match.
Fake death.
Stand on a hill mysteriously watching your own funeral, and nobody notices.
Head south.
New life on the beach waxing surfboards and rolling drunk tourists for change.
Skol!
If the wood is warped, sealing won’t help that IMO.
Its really a matter of long you want a warped shed.
If you can stand it for a couple of years, it might be worth it.
Honestly Edge, that’s a nice looking shed. No idea what your finances are like, but I would pay a carpenter to come in and replace the warped panels with sealed lumber that will withstand the elements a little better.
That’s fair. Right, I like the shed. Just that discoloration is yuck.
Finances are totally strapped with the wedding in July lol. After that we will have a lot of extra income.
We can start a gofund my shed page….
😂
Cabot paint that’s used for decking would do the trick. Gotta power wash and clean it before you put it on.
Realistically they hold all the leverage though right? I mean no way they take on his whole contract
If they want him.
I don’t see it.
I think the only way it happens is if Cook takes less $$
We’re the Bad News Bears of the NFL.
This sounds…
so….
familiar.
It’s a lot of money and QB has the largest percentage effect on a teams direction and ability to compete. So yeah…take your time.
in my opinion… which I’ve said a few times….
kirk is going to push for top dollar like the young fellas.
Kwesi wants a Carr type deal.
Reality should bring it closer to the Kwesi side of the equation.
Cousins already offered his services at below market value and KAM didn’t want to fully guarantee 2025. If Cousins “pushes for top dollar like the young fellas” then KAM missed wide right by deciding not to accept the offer.
I maintain Cousins will be a free agent at the end of 2023 and walk.
You have no idea what Cousins offered.
He did demand fully guaranteed money, which Kwesi said no to.
Exactly.
Give him 3/105
guarantee the bonus and a year.
add incentives for TDs and Accolades.
want to make 45m? Win MVP.
want 50m? Win Super Bowl MVP.
He’s walking… grin.
Did he text you and tell you this?
Laughing… don’t be snarky Mick.
How else would you know he’d walk?
foolish choice in my opinion.
there’s 2 choices…
A. He thinks he can win championships and money is an afterthought.
B. He just wants the most money possible and winning doesn’t matter.
Cousins came to the Vikings thinking he was going to be on a Championship team. What he ended up with was a front office and Head Coach relationship almost as dysfunctional as the one he left in Washington. He loved the locker room though and knew the team could win. Just didn’t pan out. This was a lesson learned for Cousins. While KAM and KOC are being lauded for their inclusive and collaborative persona’s by the media, Cousins knows this isn’t a kumbaya relationship with the players at all. So yes, he will walk, and yes he will only sign with a team he thinks can win a Championship. He has many other options including retirement he can choose from. In the end, Cousins will do what is best for him, as he should. The NFL doesn’t care about him, his GM and Coach don’t either. Never forget that.
Are you a turd in his pocket or talking in 3rd person?
has Kirk ever made any of these statements publicly?
or is this all an opinion of a fan?
what facts do you base any of those statements on?
This reads like an obituary.
It it your opinion then that Kirk should be getting the same salaries as Lamar, Hurts, or Mahomes?
What’s his value? OTC has him at 34m.
what options does he have?
what precedent is there for a franchise to hand out top end money to a 36 year old free agent?
Stop being personally insulting if you want to have a discussion with me on any subject Mick.
you are speaking matter of factly on subjects you wouldn’t be able to speak as such unless you were the two.
you cannot say what Kirk thinks or knows or wants to do.
you are not him.
you’re not his dad.
or his uncle
oe whatever. As far as we know.
So to speak like you know… when you don’t… is silly.
You fail to accept that I watched the Cousins contract battle with Bruce Allen play out. He ended up doing what was best for him and walking. he then got the first fully guaranteed contract in NFL history. Cousins track record shows he knows how good he is, he knows his worth, and he’ll do what is right for him in the end.
He was how old?
not 36.
You’re stuck in some time loop and under the belief that Kirk is ageless and has another 10 years to play.
he doesn’t.
And you think he’s going suddenly fall off a cliff at age 36… yes Cousins has many more great years in him Mick.
Not 36.
Ive said he has some time.
I also said I wouldn’t fully guarantee a 3-4 year deal for a 36 year old QB.
YOU WOULD.
That is the issue you aren’t understanding .
Yes I would because said QB has never had a “down” year since he became a starter. He has always produced at a high level. So you wouldn’t pay a 36 year old QB a fully guaranteed contract. Fine. Good to go.
You are stuck on that age thing. It’s non sequitur. His production continues to be there every single year.
How is it not a factor?
How can you have an honest conversation and not include it being relevant.
Here look what Peyton Manning has done in his career. Let’s pay him top dollar regardless of his age.
The argument is theoretical and opinionated. You insist because is 36 no one should pay him what he’s worth. That is your perspective only Mick. It’s just an opinion.
No.
the value of a 36 year old QB is well established.
you’re saying he should be paid like his peers 10 years younger than him.
And of those QBs who are 35 and older.
only QBs who have won…
MVP
All Pros
OPOTY
or…
Conference championship games have received high end deals.
Kirk has done none of those and you are suggesting that he should just because.
You continue to act like Cousins is just a run of the mill QB, that age defines a players worth, and in no way should a proven vet be paid more than young guys.
We are are many thousands of miles apart on this and I see your arguments as really just rationalizations.
If you’re not “run of the mill”
you win MVP
you win OPOTY
youre voted All Pro.
No… you don’t… if you produce at a higher level than your peers you’re exceptional.
His “worth” is approximately 35m a year per multiple sites.
Im ok wkth that.
I’m not ok with a fully guaranteed deal on a 36 year old QB.
I have said this multiple time.
What number do you put on it?
how many years? Fully guaranteed?
is this your team?
or just your player?
Cousins “worth” is whatever a team will pay for him. What would you pay for a QB who over the last 5 seasons has completed 68% of his passes for 20,934 yards, averaging over 261 yards a game, with 153 passing TD’s, and a 100.9 passer rating? Behind one of the worst pass blocking lines in the league and with a different OC every year?
What would you pay for a guy who can do that?
A lot more at 26 than 36
Hell even 30.
Fine… great… then when Cousins walks you should be happy not mad.
You’re upset because Cousins won’t accept a deal for less money than he’s worth. You say he has no right to be paid for his exceptional production because he’s 36. You say you want a younger guy who can produce like Cousins and pay him more.
That really doesn’t make sense to me.
You have no idea what has or has not been offered.
and neither do I.
I think we both know where this is going Mick, and as I said, Cousins will politely decline the less than stellar contract KAM is looking at. The Vikings are in fiscal trouble. KAM will be forced to let Cousins walk. It’s really that simple.
It isn’t.
and you’re being foolish if you think so.
For a longer term contract age is relevant but I agree Kirk takes care of himself as well or probably better than most QB’s.
Really?
How many other QB’s that are over 30 do you follow even remotely close enough to make a comment like this?
yes he has longevity, he has remained in the league as a starter without ever winning any individual awards.
Without leading his team to past the divisional round.
how many more years of guaranteed money does he need to finally get there?
At least 10 Mick, at least 10…
Exactly.
you don’t have a response.
because it’s illogical.
It’s a ridiculous question unworthy of serious consideration, which is why I was being facetious You are throwing out generalizations that are not remotely associated with Cousins individual play and then asking for a judgement based on those generalizations.
Isn’t that the hold up?
guaranteed money?
And you can’t answer that?
I think I’ve answered that somewhat repeatedly. Cousins plays consistently better than most QB’s in the NFL, and has never missed a game for injury since entering the league in 2012. He is an iron man in that regard. Also he produces at a level that few players have in the last 5 years. he is in a word, a proven product. You can pay a QB with no NFL production stats at all (Rookie) or adequate stats (vet) or you can pay for a guy who always produces. If Cousins wants guaranteed money then he’ll see who is willing to pay for his services, and how much.
If that upsets you, I’m sorry Mick. If you think he doesn’t deserve to get paid that’s fine.
Just because you lived in DC at the time, doesn’t make you a better expert.
I lived out here as well. Therefore you must agree with my take.
It’s a silly argument by you.
Nothing silly at all DE. You watched Bruce Allen publicly denigrate Cousins while offering low ball contracts. Cousins even offered to play at $18M a year fully guaranteed for 3 years and Allen rebuffed him and he played under the franchise tag at $19.9M for one year. Then he was low balled again and played another year at $22M on the franchise tag. Allen could have signed him for $18M a year and instead paid him $41M for two years. Then when the franchise tag for a third year went to $33M Allen knew he was beat and brought in Alex Smith. Cousins proved he was better at the game than Bruce Allen. He crossed a bridge he isn’t going to go back over.
I have friends out here who thought the opposite. That Cousins wasn’t worth it.
How come your view is right?
People have opinions. Mostly emotionally driven. I’m data driven. The Redskins were 7-25 the two years before Cousins became the full time starter. In the three years he started he broke numerous franchise records while also making the team far more competitive. Basically (like here) the passing offense was the only good part of the team his whole tenure. The Redskins record with Cousins was 24-23-1. Since he left they have gone through 11 QB’s who have tallied 95 passing TD’s and their record is 32-49-1. Before Cousins the Redskins were really bad. With Cousins and the potent passing game he brings, the Redskins were competitive and won the NFC East in 2015. Without Cousins they have faltered mightily. That’s how I view this DE.
Wins aren’t a QB stat.
Unless you want it to be a stat to support Cousins.
Who EVER did that here (wins are a stat to support Cousins)? I certainly haven’t. Wins are a team game. One guy on a 53 man roster is never solely responsible for wins.
You did.
So I also said “With Cousins and the potent passing game he brings, the Redskins were competitive and won the NFC East in 2015.” Cousins contributions were clearly a difference maker in the Redskins ability to compete. With his production they stayed in games and were able to put up enough points to overcome the rest of the teams inadequacies. Without that contribution, the Redskins were a sad team indeed to watch.
Vikings were 39-25 before Kirk .609
46-33-1 .575. Since
Better than 32-49-1 though huh?
I seriously wonder if the Kirk haters will admit they were wrong if he walks and we go into another QB hell.
No they won’t. They’ll fall back on the “he wasn’t worth the money and never won anything” argument as well as the “he was too old to pay him” argument.
There is nothing to admit.
Kirk had his chance.
If he wins an owl somewhere else, good for him.
You seem very nice DE, so let’s just say we’re completely on opposite sides of this argument. Cousins is a great QB, the rest of the team sucks, so let’s get rid of the one guy who always produces.
Admit what?
You and Kirk sniffers make a wrong assumption.
The “haters” aren’t saying someone else is automatically better. The realists say after watching Kirk for 8 years go
9-7ish and no playoff run, he has had his chance. It’s time to try something new.
Total faulty logic though De. Most productive QB in Vikings history and 4th best in the league the last 5 years. Let’s move on from our totally proven, top shelf QB because the entire rest of the team has failed mightily.
Yep.
An incentive laden contract is kinda insulting to a vet. You give rookies incentives. Cousins doesn’t have to prove anything to anybody. His consistently high production every year since he became a starter is out there for all to see. Only QB in the NFL that has thrown at least 25 TD’s every year since 2015. His production speaks for itself.
Walk where?
he’s not a 45m/year QB.
you parrot this over and over and over and over and over again. Amid all the off-season rumors you have put this one in gold.
a 36 year old qb who’s never been to a championship game, never won MVP, never won OPOY, never been an all pro… doesn’t get the same contract as a 24-26 year old who has.
thwy don’t get the same contract as a 24-26 year old because they are on the downhill of their careers not the uphill.
a Carr type deal for Cousins is very fair. Especially given the weapons the offense has.
if it’s all about the money? Go find another basement franchise to hand it out.
Wait and see my friend. Wait and see.
Would you pay a 20 year grunt the same as a 20 year top ranking officer?
Well that’s an interesting comparison. Which one would you say Cousins is of those two choices?
Personally…
he’s the politically correct guy who’s says and does the right things but has never accomplished anything.
can he?
sure. Maybe. Nobody knows because he hasn’t.
He has no history to go off of for how he’d do, but apparently “he” or you thinks he should be paid like the guy who has accomplished thing.
he’s been a 10 year starter in the league and that’s it.
good for him.
so was Alex Smith but he made a conference championship
He’s thrown more TD’s in the last 5 years than all but three QB’s in the league. He owns 11 Redskins franchise records and more than a few Vikings franchise records. Cousins has consistently been one of the top QB’s in the league ever since he usurped RGIII. You say he hasn’t done anything. That intones that one player and only one player on a team is the deciding factor for wins and losses. That is ridiculous in the extreme. Brady had a great year last year. How’d the Bucs do? Great teams win Championships Mick.
MVP – 0
OPOTY – 0
All Pro – 0
Those are accolades.
Its great that he’s got some team records… in a league with lifespans this short… on franchises who don’t have franchise QBs it isn’t hard.
hows he stack up on the packers all time?
patriots?
Colts?
Its not the same.
What he did staying in games, keeping it mentally together as contests went back and forth and giving his team the chance to win at the end in all those close games last year was one of the most amazing seasons I’ve ever watched as a fan. He is playing at a very very high level right now.
He is.
but you dont guarantee a deal for 3 more years on what he did last year at 36.
26 sure. But those 10 years make a difference.
He stacks up very well in career production. He’s one of the best QB’s in the league. If you base your opinion of Cousins on “accolades” that others bestow on him, rather than his actual play and production, then you’re chasing false prophets.
This Cousins stuff is sad in several ways. I find it more enlightening to actually watch games (old ones too) than opine away. So I will give you a game that fits all the narrative – 2020 game against Seattle. Cousins led two fourth quarter drives, both over 80 yards, for a TD and the second failed on a fourth and one at he nine from poor blocking. Still we had a 4 point lead but of course lets Seattle march 91 yards in the final minute and score the winning TD.
This game had it all. Cousins can’t win in prime time. Cousins can’t win under the lights. Cousins can’t win against good teams -believe Seattle won 12 games that year.
Yet, Cousins played brilliantly. Standing in their often under big time rush delivering strike after strike.
I like Kirk as QB.
I don’t like Kirk fully guaranteed for 3 more year at 40m or more.
hes already getting this year.
pay him for next year
give him incentives
and have him under contract for ‘25 based on how ‘23&’24 go.
this isn’t rocket science.
No is isn’t rocket science. But you place a lot on age. Yet he has pproven to be one of the most reliable, resilient QB’s over the last decade. Look at the young guys, Murray, Hurts, Jackson – look at all the games they miss regularly. Perhaps Cousins may be more of an outlier than you give him credit for.
And I don’t care how they do it, but if they don’t have him on the roster for 2024 they are stupid.
I would prefer he’s here as well, he’s been a good QB.
but at 3/120 fully guaranteed I’ll go without.
Age doesn’t lose.
never has and never will.
The offense weapons put in place will be fantastic for the next guy.
So why are you giving me so much grief for saying Cousins walks next year? In your mind he’s too old, and some other guy can come in for less money and you’re fine with that.
You’re getting exactly what you want. A younger cheaper guy when Cousins walks. You should be jumping for joy. Instead you’re on here telling me he shouldn’t get paid, but he should stay. Either he’s really good (he is) and deserves to get paid, or he’s not as you assert, and should not get paid.
I can’t figure you out Mick.
That’s on you then.
I’ve clearly articulated my side many times.
you see “don’t pay Kirk” and you go into defensive mode defending him like I’m saying he’s bad.
im not.
but you don’t pay the same for a 3 year old used car and a 13 year old used car… even though the 13 year old car has “been dependable.”
I’m not in defensive mode here Mick. Your argument is not all that rational as much as you insist it is. That’s all.
I don’t see how its irrational.
You can’t point to a similar player who was paid at the top of their position groups with the resume of Kirk Cousins.
It’s unprecedented.
BUT
“Kirk is different.”
thats what you’re falling back on.
It’s irrational because of all the faulty logic and generalizations you’re throwing around rather than the data I am basing my position on.
No one else gets paid like this… means Cousins produces like any other QB ever, so he rationally (to you) should receive the same compensation as others. You base all this on accolades of others, and wins and losses.
I base my position on the real data that shows how good Cousins is.
Your position is that stats will mean Kirk should get paid.
and nothing else
not age.
not accolades
nothing.
stats.
by stats alone RG3 should’ve owned the NFL.
Just like Vince Young and Tim Tebow.
but that’s not the case.
Career production like Cousins is far from the norm in the NFL. You call that “just stats” and of course stats mean far less than some award some media type levies on a player. Reality Mick, we’re talking reality here.
Cousins produces. Period.
Championships matter.
not stats.
think the eagles cared if it was foles or wentz who was QB in the SB?
nope.
Championships are won by teams… why do you insist one player on a team of 53 is responsible for winning a Championship? Basing your argument on that is pretty weak sauce Mick.
He hasn’t produced enough to win a league wide award or recognition.
according to you it’s conspiracy.
No, individually each year one player or another gets voted some award or other. What you see from Cousins is continuously strong production every single year. He doesn’t get injured and miss games, he throws more TD’s than most and he plays well despite bad lines, and a new OC every year. He has benefitted from having a strong receiving corps, but he has to take a lot of hits to get them the ball.
That’s a very good analogy there JR. Cousins has been the victim of a bad O-line, a bad defense, and a bad kicker basically his entire career. Yet the narratives you present are out there and people completely buy into them.
What I say to the naysayers is this. Tell me which of these things have been consistently good to great for the Vikings over the last 5 years?
The passing gameThe running gameThe defenseThe O-lineThe kicking gameSomething else
I got to hand it to you. I haven’t heard the blame the kicker excuse before.
The Vikings kicking woes are legendary. The Redskins lost 5 games with missed field goals when Cousins was there. So… yeah. It’s in the math.
Noticed though you have nothing for the real point I made. Only the passing offense has been consistently good to great since Cousins has been here.
The counter argument here Mick is Cousins experience to be successful today verses a young developing QB with high upside who hasn’t seen nearly as much as Cousins and frankly isn’t near his level on a mental basis. Sure physically might be a better athlete but thrower and processor and understanding what they;re seeing….eh I’d give Cousins the edge there and that’s what you pay top dollar for.
LOL.
Its been 8 years. How much longer do you want to wait?
You missed the point, I’m saying Cousins is walking next year and Mick is arguing some point that eludes me. On one hand Mick argues that Cousins is too old to get paid, but also says he’s a good QB and we should keep him. I guess for whatever price Mick determines is the right price.
To me, KAM knows he has to let Cousins walk, he just doesn’t want to have to say it in public.
Ya know NVF, that’s shit.
I’ve been very clear with what I’ve been saying. You want to intentionally convolute what I say for imaginary internet points that’s on you.
I think anyone who reads our back and forth would admit my position is based on data points and yours on false narratives and generalizations focused on awards, and team records. Cousins himself is a quality QB. The rest of the team is not very good. That is my point and always has been. You lump the teams performance in with Cousins which is folly.
I agree with this take Mick. He’s getting a contract purely based on what he can give a team this year or next to compete for a championship and that’s about it.
To date he’s about the only thing (with JJ) that gives the Vikings a chance to win a Championship.
I’d probable throw in Hock and our two offensive tackles. Those five are about it – that play at a high level required of their positions. Worth noting, all those folks are on offense and the key to offense in the NFL is the QB. Yet. let’s just chuck the QB and we’ll go happily on our way.
I’ve yet to say ditch Kirk.
I have said…
paying a 36 year old a fully guaranteed deal at the top of the market is a bad plan. And that said 36 year old qb is not worth that.
Kirk isn’t asking for top of the market fully guaranteed money. It’s barely top ten money at this juncture.
nobody knows what he is asking for.
Nobody.
Just rumors out there is all.
Lol
Again, you mention age. Off my head, I’d say brady did OK as he got older. But wer’re not allowed to compare anyone to Brady right. But still, history is replete with older athletes who perform at the highest levels despite age.
Again, if I owned this team, and Cousins (or someone just as good) is under center to start 2024, I’m firing the QM
Compare Brady.. that’s one guy.
Throw in Manning, Brees, and Warner.
These are anomalies not the norm.
Phillip Rivers put up big numbers too.
Took care of himself.
How much were people racing for his services?
Are we limited to just athletes who play football? And I’m suggesting maybe Cousins is not your “norm.”
Manning, Brees, and Warner all suffered serious injuries.
And Rivers, Cousins looks like a ballerina in the pocket compared to him.
Can see you’re not going to change on this “age” thing. Fine. You mention how much to pay. so let me ask, Cousins walks, we suck in 24 and 25 and don’t have a good prospect for 25, Was it worth quibbling over money for 25.
Again, you’re getting fired as Gm if this happens and I own the team.
Kirk will not get a fully guaranteed deal from any team over 3 years 40m.
Do you get fired for letting Kirk walk or for giving him guarantee money when his play drops off a cliff at 38?
So what? I don’t care about any of the other teams. I care about the Vikings and their needs.
Me too.
and writing kirk a check for 120m for the next 3 years is stupid.
I’ve asked for numbers.
or contract structure.
and nobody but me throws it out there.
let’s hear when you have
You want numbrs -I’ll go 35 for three.
Deal.
guarantee two of em.
add in incentives for awards and achievements.
By age 38 we have an idea where he’ll be on the last year of they deal.
Cousins won’t be here at age 38…
You cannot said things like this unless you are Kirk or have a close relationship with him.
you have denied both.
It’s a blog Mick… I can say anything I want. Of course this is my take… that goes without saying (or should). I don’t see any way Cousins is here past 2023.
As the owner of the Vikings at this point, I’m more likely to fire you for getting rid of Kirk. I’ll take the age risk over the uncertainty risk -especially at the QB position. And Kirk has been a solid citizen for the Viking organization
Where do I get rid of him?
cause I’d don’t give him everything he wants?
maybe if he wins the Super Bowl this year I’ll be more open to it.
but a fully guaranteed deal at the top of the market he can walk away and get laughed out of 31 other teams headquarters as well.
You mean if the Vikings team wins a Super Bowl. Cousins isn’t the only player on the team.
Must we take things to extreme. I never suggested “give him everything he wants.” You get fired for taking an unnecessary risk, for a few bucks, and coming up short leaving us without a capable QB under center.
and also, I didn’t suggest “fully guaranteed at the top of the Market.” And this is a business. While it may seem unpleasant to be laughed at by 31 other headquarters, that is still far more pleasant than being on the wrong side of the team owner(s).
Per reports and the parrots on the board he wants a fully guaranteed deal.
that is unacceptable at 36.
Why unacceptable? again,speaking as the owner, if he plays well this year and next, and then falls off some, I can live with that. I cannot live with two crappy years following the 23 season.
As an aside, beiieve. he is actually 34 today, Where’s the 36 come from you keep mentioning..
It’s unacceptable because Mick says so, that’s about it.
Kirk is 34 right now. 35 in august. And will be 36 when his new deal would be in effect.
It’s unacceptable because it’s never been done. Not for Brady, not for Brees, or Manning, Rodgers, or anyone.
Two QBs got multi year fully guaranteed deals and that’s it.
Neither of them were 36.
Age is a factor and when you have to sock away that money in the bank. The real cash for a deal like that….
On top of for JJ, Hock, Darrisaw, and more… it is unacceptable.
If he plays well this year and next year guess what? He’s earned the bloated part of that contract.
Unacceptable to you…
Please tell me under your scenario, if he walks at the end of this year, who is going under center?
And even if he falls off some, how much are you going to be paying for a QB of his caliber in 25? By 25, 35 mil will look very cheap. Oh right, our capable staff is going to draft the replacement. I’d rather bet on Cousins’ health than that. But hay, to each his own.
These older athletes you speak of are the best of the best.
Kirk is not Brady. He’s not Manning.
He’s not Jordan or Lebron.
He’s Kirk Cousins.
Kirk and Phillip Rivers have near identical stat lines.
at 37 Rivers went 12-4 and got bounced by the Pats.
at 38 Rivers went 5-11 and was cut.
With these 3 year fully guaranteed deals…we’re still into kirk for another season after that.
He’s one of the best QB’s in the league for the last 5 years running… you act like he’s a nobody.
So was Phillip Rivers.
I act like I take all things into consideration not just individual stats.
The ONLY thing you can use to evaluate a players production is their career stats. Awards are perceptions and opinions of others. Hard production stats have nothing to do with emotions, impressions, or opinions. Over time they show the quality of the player. The quality of the player is what you pay for, not the quality of the performance of the rest of the team around him.
The Vikings drafting a QB this year in the 5th changes nothing about a Kirk succession plan.
Agree
More I look at this class we drafted and signed the more I like the fit of these players. Whether they make the team or contribute remains to be seen but most of the players seem to be nice fits for their skill sets.
Well… they have a “plan”
If it works? Great!
If it doesn’t? Then KO isn’t Bud Grant
Vikings have spent what? 8 picks
On defense the last two years?
7 of them in the top 150
Jaren Hall = Discount Kyler Murray lol
It will be interesting if KAM gets fleeced by Cousins.
I got a feeling KAM caves.
I don’t think so but it really all depends on Kirk bending a bit so the roster can be built out. In the S2 Cog testing video I posted below he talks about having players who are good enough to compete and those that aren’t so he understands what it takes to put a winning team together. He also studies investing and finance as a hobby so he is intrinsically interested in making a profit. How much influence his agent welds is also a factor.
What is fleeced?
and Caves?
what are those numbers?
$38 million guaranteed average.
38m and higher is the Vikings losing?
KAM caving yes.
I assume Kirk wanted $35 million guaranteed in 2024, based on his agents leak that it was “reasonable”. Since KAM said no, anything more than $35 million guaranteed is a cave.
I dont know and can’t speak to “what” was offered
just what I’d be comfortable with.
I agree.
No idea what was offered.
But since KAM said no to guaranteed in 2024, if he now agrees to fully guarantee in 2024, KAM caved.
I thought he said no to ‘25.
I gotta find the article.
im all for ‘24 being guaranteed.
not ‘25.
im advocating to keep Kirk and the biggest Kirk lover here wants him to leave because Kirk is “reportedly scorned.”
Sorry. It’s 2025. My bad.
I never said I wanted Cousins to leave, nor that he’s leaving because he’s scorned. I said he’s leaving because KAM is unwilling to pay him guaranteed money and include a no trade clause in the contract, plus fiscally KAM has to get his house in order. Add that all up, and Cousins is a free agent in 2024 and walks IMO.
Here is Jaren Hall’s passing depth “chart”
Better than Levis at least
Lol.
doubt he’s ahead of Mullens on the Depth chart.
Maybe the Vikings deal Mullens.
UDFA K Jack Podlesny missed one XP while at GA. 153/154
he was 50/60 over three years on FGs
3 misses from 30-39
5 misses from 40-49
2 misses from 50+
83% on field goals.
Only missed 2 last year.
23/25
Believes there’s a dead hit on Joseph as well:
They call this leverage.
all set.
rick loved him
Question, is the new qb any better than Mond or did we draft Mond 2.0?
He is more your tradition cerebral thinking QB, really smart strong arm. Is athletic and ran a lot but has had injuries of which I’m not sure what type and how much longterm effect they may have on his development. He’s a solid prospect but likely is backup material at best.
Hes a what? A 5th round qb?
I wouldn’t set the bar high.
No, people shouldn’t be calling for him to start when Kirk throws a checkdown.
True. But maybe if Kirk throws short on 4th and 8?
In the playoffs?
I’ll allow it
I probably will anyways. Favorite QB is always the Backup QB that has not failed yet.
I still think Kirk gets extended before the season starts. I just hope the no trade part goes away in case they find someone they fell is better.
I don’t think that’s in the cards Surly. Cousins forged a path in his NFL career that is unlike any other player in history. He beat the system. He won’t acquiesce to a contract without a no trade clause. Simply not an option for him. He basically has made that abundantly clear throughout his career. He won’t allow any GM to control him after the indignations he went through under Bruce Allen.
He’s not good, Mond 2.0
Lol…..dude looks 40. But he’s a man.
😂
NFL draft grades.
Everyone is a winner!
Lowest grade is a C+.
https://www.nfl.com/news/2023-nfl-draft-final-quick-snap-grades-for-all-32-teams
I was just thinking as I was burning though all the UDFA lists….the whole entire draft process is just OPINIONS!
I mean literally we’re talking about people’s opinion here when they pick or don’t pick players. We rant and rave about “damn I wanted that guy, or didn’t want this guy” when in reality…it’s just your opinion man. Where a guy is drafted doesn’t mean a god damn thing other than in that GM’s / teams opinion they wanted to pick him there. Thats it, nothing more.
Yep.
But fans need something to complain about, so they feed us.
LOL….
Good Luck Ivan!
Hope he makes the team and an impact.
Right now he’s more of a “specialist” if he makes the team but could be a boon for the Vikings lack of pass rush.
I wanted a pass rushing LB. And he seems to be that type of player.
He’s got a little more beef than Asamoah for NVF’s liking…
but the days of monster LBs are gone
He’s 5’10” and 231… he’s slow too so he has that going for him. One would think Flores knows what he’s doing though and if he sees this guy as a quality player, then he likely is.
Looking at our ED situation, Davenport / Z-Smith, Hunter / Wonnum if we can keep Z and Hunter we’re in great shape there. Really is the interior DL we’re a little suspect. If Tonga can keep up his level of play should be good in the middle, the left 3tech spot with Lowery / Lynch is very suspect. Need an upgrade there.
That’s a lot of players who haven’t done much over the last two years.
”competitive rebuild” I guess.
Hunter, ZD and Davenport are legit. Phillips is solid and Tonga had a good year last year. Wonnum has really played well I think he’s earned more reps. It’s not a terrible front DL but it’s no Eagles or San Fran units either.
I see why it seemed like they weren’t doing much for Flores with the Addison pick to help the defense but actually it was selective spots they added guys to round things out then went heavy CB in the draft.
I don’t know. I just find it hard to believe that Flores will be the guy to fire up a defense that has had no fire under previous D coordinators. I lean towards the players as the problem.
Biggest effect on this defense is whether or not they can keep Hunter and Z. Flores needs both of them to stay to really maximize his pressure scheme.
Is the “fire” the scheme or the players?
They Vikings are going to be starting what? 6 new starters and a new DC?
3 new cbs new lb new edge new DL.
returning as of now?
Phillips
Z
Hunter
Hicks
Harry
am I missing anyone?
Of course scheme natters. But you still have to rush the passer, cover receivers and above all tackle well, regardless of scheme. And these guys have not been good at that for several years.
When the middle
of the field can be shredded by a middle school QB…
it’s tough on everyone.
Danztler?
Bynum?
Blacklock?
Dantz is gone.
Well see if Bynum Keeps his spot or not.
Blacklock didn’t start. Let’s get him some reps.
Good for him!
Andre Carter and Ivan Pace
elite UDFA pickups.
Should have signed Harbaugh, and the GM he would have wanted. Queasy sucks.
Kwesi is the one that brought Harbaugh in for the HC interview, he was hired first and they worked together in SF.
Good picks up for sure…Carter being in the Army had a hard time bulking up 6’5” 250 but now he’ll get the proper training and nutritional guidance. He might be a decent rotational guy.
Yeah if there’s anything we know about the military it’s that they don’t feed you.
It’s what they feed you jarhead
Good thing the Vikings have free food at the best facilities in the NFL.
You can see it here…get him bulked up and on a proper strength / nutrition schedule he’ll improve.
Yeah, all elite, future HOF for sure, too elite to for the draft
Ha.
they’ll be lucky to play.
highly rated pre draft… not sure why they didn’t get drafted.
Became 32 teams didn’t have them rated above 259 other players, maybe one will be the next Thielen but chances are they just aren’t good enough. Hopefully one of them works out though
Kinda how I feel across the board for all the drafted players and the UDFA’s. Hopefully a few of them will work out.
Looks like the Vikings picked up Jack Podlesny, K, Georgia as an UDFA.
Bad
drafting a bunch of unathletic guys, guess we’ll see how that plays out.
Seems polar opposite of last year
he’s a good’n
Bullshit, he sucks, otherwise he would have been picked
Yes be cause no UDFA Mr John Randle has ever been good since they weren’t picked.
Lol, 99% chance never plays a down
I’ll take that bet.
Yeah, I forgot about the UDFA work after the draft. Guess we are still bringing players in.
great.
Lol
i fucking hate Kwesi, he sucks
Some non-draft news: Former Vikings DB Chandon Sullivan is signing with the Steelers,
Packers ended up with 13 picks in the draft, Lions ended up with 8 but 2 were in the first round and 2 were in the second round. Bears? Yeah they had 10 picks.
https://twitter.com/lukebraunnfl/status/1652437959705255938?s=46&t=Q891Eaqn4KCwWb4d_1l_Uw
The third option is to keep him.
The Vikings need about $5 million in cap space to sign rookies.
Z Smith, Cook and Hunter are the biggest salaries to adjust.
Since Smith sold his house and has asked for a trade, Smith appears to be the one who gets moved.
Hunter is not a viable option to adjust for cap space
A post June 1st cut is about a $5.5 million cap savings I think.
They aren’t cutting both Z and Hunter lol
I never said both. I would guess Smith is gone before Hunter based on cap savings and Smith wanting out.
And it adds about 12 mil in ded cap to 2024, they’re not doing that
Put a banger up top to close out the draft…listen loud and enjoy!
If you are Flores, are you excited about what just went down?
Im starting to wonder if Flores was drugged and his memory wiped on his visit.
If he wasn’t, he will be when he sees first hand this group go out and actually play
Had a similar thought, is Flores wondering what he’s gotten himself into.