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The Vikings wide receiver room, which has been hit hard by the injury bug in recent weeks, is gradually getting healthier. It sounds like KJ will be back on Sunday for the Broncos game, and they say that JJ is “ramping up his workload”. I’m excited to see a healthy JJ alongside a confident and more experienced Addison, throw in a healthy KJ and top it off with Hockenson, and you have the makings of a potentially elite WR corps. Dobbs must be salivating.
Minnesota Vikings Discussion Topic of the Day
The Vikings play the Broncos on Sunday. I don’t hate the Broncos, but I do not like Sean Payton. I hope to see the Vikings destroy the Broncos (hopefully for 4 quarters this week instead of 2). What do you expect to see from the Vikings offense? Will they continue to have a lopsided offensive approach and rely heavily on the pass? Will they find a way to establish a running game now that Chandler is toting the rock?
Minnesota Vikings News:
From KSTP-TV, Kirk Cousins, along with other Vikings players, served Thanksgiving meals to families at the Salvation Army.
Minnesota Vikings wide receivers are getting healthier, according to the Minneapolis Star-Tribune. KJ Osborn is expected to play on Sunday, and Justin Jefferson is also getting closer to a return.
Vikings.com brings you a Vikings-Broncos game preview, and they have an updated Week 11 Vikings-Broncos injury report.
CBS Sports has a league-wide NFL week 11 injury report. One of the biggest (but not most shocking) injury stories is Deshaun Watson, who will miss the remainder of the 2023 season with a shoulder injury.
Justin Fields, although still not 100%, will return to play against the Lions in week 11, according to CBS Sports. Fields has been out since dislocating his thumb in week 6 against the Vikings.
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Ohio St is ‘only’ favored by 27.5 over the Rodents this weekend.
@at least its not like 4 TDs or something crazy@
Bodies dropping all over the place tonight in Baltimore
Ravens up double digits at the half..
It they win Cinci is 5-5 and not looking nearly as scary as they did when the schedule came out.
It was awful. I HATE Thursday night games, unsafe.
On line Dr ‘experts’ are saying Burroughs might be out awhile with that wrist thingie.
There are roughly 350 million people in the US and about 1.5 million in Trinidad Tobago. The two nations are tied 20+ minutes into tonight’s international soccer match up. We should be up like 125 to nil, based on the above ratio. I love this country but our soccer team needs to get their head out of their Biden/Trump.
This is not a political comment because I took a neutral position.
It is only soccer so nobody in the US cares.
Personally since I don’t really care I don’t mind if some little country has success as it means so very much more to them than it does to me. As long as it is not a ‘little country’ that wants to kill us.
The announcers just said you are on the Trinidad and Tobago kill list if they win.
Trinidad and Tobago will want to kill me if they win? Because I am ok with them winning?
More likely they will be mad and want to kill you if they lose. Because you wanted them to lose.
Either way the Souther Border is wide open for them.
It’s a joke
@really?? I couldn’t tell.@
#myresponsewasajoke
Watching TNF and I’m convinced Irv Smith Jr is about to have his breakout performance. He’s due.
any year now.
Wait for it. It’s gonna be huge.
300
Do you have a leather diaper like they did in that movie?
evans hurt again? great. season over
At least Hall is FP,
No Manniquin this week.
Booth time
Not sure how many Sirius XM users there are around here but they’ve been heavily promoting Dolly Parton’s “Dolly’s Rockstar Radio” channel on NFL Radio. She covers a bunch of classic rock tunes and based on the few clips they play during the promo, she’s going to single-handedly ruin Rock n Roll music forever (The Beatles ‘Let it be’ is one of them).
Thankfully, it’s only available for a limited time.
You’re just upset because you can’t look at her boobs while she sings because Radio.
To be fair thats a legit gripe. They may be fake but they are nice
Looks like she hit right where she was aiming.
https://twitter.com/barstoolsports/status/1725147205827252330?t=N1Bn1Nrorz8AxLQDhNjU8w&s=19
no no, she only did that like ONE time, she promises.
I’m with her, I don’t understand the purpose of these reports anyhow, other than it is my signal for last chance to grab a Zima before the second half kickoff.
You should try this with your lab
That seems cruel. Poor doggo.
Who am I to talk? My chocos smelled like the creature from the black lagoon after slogging through creek muck all morning, to reward them I stopped at the lake to swim them “but dad we are sore and tired and just started warming up!!” “Silence you sniveling hounds go fetch those tennis balls in the ice cold water”
Once the ‘doggo’ fetches the ball/toy and declines to bring it back to you it is a ‘clue’ that he/she needs a break.
As much as they love to play/fetch a break has to be granted.
Which Beatle are you? Ben you are a huge fan and should stop whatever you’re doing and take it right now. Looks super accurate too.
The irony is that Twitter and social media wouldn’t exist if it wasn’t for the Beatles.
I heard 100% of millennials were conceived during a Beatles song.
Not only that but all of the OB-GYN’s that delivered the babies were medically trained by the Beatles.
This guy gets it.
Do you have a link?
https://www.buzzfeed.com/piperthomas/which-beatles-member-are-you-4n61hz8sbm
Heh listening to the audio takes me back.
Saw a click bait headline that Snoop Dog is quitting weed.
I call bullshit.
That’s his Twitter account.
must be a bit about smokeless pot or something.
He just released a line of cannabis suppositories.
I’m going to share one later with the wife.
No pictures please.
I mean, “give up smoke” could mean many things.
Could be smoked meat.
Could be that liquid smoke in a bottle.
Could be cigarettes/cigar.
Maryjane is now mostly legal and Snoop is now going to give it up?
I gotta feeling this is a PR move of some sort.
Losing to Payton will piss me off, can’t stand looking at him.
I know this award is always subjective based on the whims of voters, but if the Vikings stay the course and make the playoffs, I’ll be pissed if KOC doesn’t win. The two front runners are Dan Campbell and Mike McDaniels, both of whom are doing what was expected when the season started (but they’re entertaining in front of a mic), whereas KOC is doing the near impossible, never been done before.
But Campbell will probably win it simply because he used the word ‘diaper’ in a press conference. That said, win by the Diaper, die by the Diaper, Dan. I’m hoping it’s just a matter of time before his “diaper philosophy” chaps his ass…all the better if it happens against the Vikings, twice.
Either way he has a big, stupid face.
Admit it. You laughed.
Playoff to maybe canned.
He should go back to the Bills
There was some talk about QB accuracy earlier, and I’m too lazy to scroll down.
Here’s the tweet. Note: it’s not the same as completion percentage and I don’t know if it’s crap or not. But Dobbs’ accuracy has certainly improved on the Vikings.
i wonder why the accuracy has gone up here.
i am sure there are a number of factors for a qb’s accuracy (time to throw, route being run, who they are throwing to, weather, etc) but it begs the question.
good though, let’s keep dobbs trending up!
I was using PFR completion % data which isn’t the same thing as “accuracy”
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/years/2023/passing.htm
https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/D/DobbJo00.htm
That’s a good metric.
I just wanted to clarify “accuracy” since I have no idea what radius they give for a decent throw, but it also removes spikes, throwaways and drops.
Curious if ‘bad throw’ or ‘good throw’ is dependent on results.
Like KC intercepted pass that got taken away from Addison vs the 49s and the one Addison took away for the touchdown just before halftime.
They define it as passes “on target” without qualifying if it was a catch or not. They remove spikes and throw aways.
I’m not sure exactly the radius of on target is.
The accuracy leaders
Dak 84%
Goff 83%
Kirk 82%
Hurts 81%
Mahomes 81%
Allen 81%
Tua 79%
The lowest out of the 33 listed is Tannehill at 71%.
So basically for accuracy the difference between the best and worst starter is 13%.
So tipped balls are judged on where the ball was when it was tipped or where it ended up after the tip?
Was the pass to Hock in the end zone that was tipped/intercepted Good Throw (pre tip) or Bad Throw due to where it ended up after hitting Hocks hands.
Additionally if the throw is slightly behind/ahead/over the receiver
because that is were the best chance of a reception vs an interception (i.e. allowing JJ to make a play on 4th down vs Bills) is that considered Bad or Good?
Good vs Bad is way too simplistic a rating without full context. IMHO
Tips are removed.
They use some fancy computer with a defined radius to determine if a ball is thrown where it is supposed to be.
I’d just use this alongside completion percentage to get a decent idea of what’s going on. It actually tracks well with completion percentage.
I doubt his accuracy is an issue – it seems fine. But I also think the idea that his legs make up for a little loss of accuracy is a bit of a false issue too.
Was going to get on Wolves wagon then they get smacked around by Phoenix, ugh..
it happens, especially on a back to back night, plus Phoenix is one of the better teams
All i know one should get some kind of posthumous medal for being a life long Minny sports fan.
Evander Kane put up a natural hatty late in the third and in OT last night to come back from 3-1 deficit to beat the Kraken. That’s gotta sting.
Not looked close but seem to be playing better. Mild D and penalty kill is unwatcheable.
Is that in this Ice Soccer sport?
81 game season, they wernt going to win out thats for sure. They played a lot of good teams and traveled a lot the past week. Ill cut em some slack. Still a fun team to watch…for now.
Plus it was a back to back game against a good team.
Yeah they saved all their energy for Golden State…buncha cry babies. Their team is old and it looks old
Scheduling is questionable. Didn’t like point spread.
Loved Studwell. Him, Doleman and Millard are forever stamped into my brain.
Alan Page.
I’m 45. If I saw Page play it was when I was 2 or 3. No memory of that.
Pretty much 1984-1990 was when I was between 6-12.
Those guys were my childhood. Should add Browner just to cover all of my favorites on defense.
Same. Same age. Same frame of reference.
I’m 65 and didn’t get to watch a whole of of him due to no cable TV, no internet and being ‘out of market’ at the time.
But what I did see was amazing.
Then Player of the Year as a Defender.
Then his career after he retired cemented to me how awesome was.
Me too. John Randle is my all time favorite Viking – but Studwell, Millard, Doleman, Merriweather, Carl Lee, Joey Browner – those guys were my introduction to Vikings football and forever cemented my identity as a Vikings fan.
Joey Browner. So many horse-collar tackles that would be flagged today.
Keith Millard was also fun to watch and a surprisingly kind person.
Chuck Foreman
Man, I am feeling old.
John Randle and Randy Moss from those teams.
Good stuff.
You know who also gets overlooked? Ed McDaniel – loved that guy.
Jeff Christy
Put me down for two!
We had a really good run of centers going. Christy, Birk and Sullivan. They were all fun to watch. But Christy was by far the best.
Great player. Gary Zimmerman too while he was in purple, continued in Denver.
Studwell was my favorite player as a child just learning about football, probably always will be.
It’s cliché and I don’t care… John Randle!
I see you Edge…
#44
Chuck Foreman
Tarkenton by a mile for me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zoNEZL-kUuk
Tackles had lots of blind side hits when he turned, loved them.
Yep.
Always amazing watching Tark.
He had radar or something. Just knew when to move.
https://twitter.com/QuirkyResearch/status/1453343393493536768
Is it the current or former Vikings RB?
Both good possibilities.
Woof! Good point.
Mattison?
Mo Clarett
Since being proven right feels good, I will also state where I was wrong so as to not come off as as totally “self serving”. Flores is a goddamn miracle worker. I was on the doomer train when it came to the defense, I figured he would help, but to take the defense with 90% of the same players from 30ish in total defense to top 10-15ish depending on your metrics, in less than a full season is WILD to me and I was hammering that that wasnt going to happen, and it did. Bravo. Could not be more than pleased to eat crow. Pay him all the money.
Crow tastes extra good when the team’s winning. I’ll admit I was hoping he could significantly improve the D in a short amount of time, but wasn’t confident at all.
Some fans have trouble separating what they “want” the team to do and what they “think” the team will do based on history. And they often push one mind set over the other rarely taking both into account. I wanted them to do it but thought it was close to impossible, I was wrong.
Thoughtful and a bit surprising (that the defense has done this well). Hoping it will stand up last month of season playing Cincy and Lions twice.
And what have you been proven right about?
As often as he moves the ‘goalposts’ he can find something that he was right about eventually.
Or he will just move the ‘goalposts’ again and claim he ‘called’ what is going on currently.
Please give me an example of goal post moving. All of our chats are documented, I would like to see an example as evidence that isnt based on your emotional reaction to my posts.
Don’t do it, once you give him one he will ask for another example… lol
Always an excuse.
Like when he was on the ‘Tank for Crybaby’ train.
Once USC started losing it became ‘No one called for Tanking for him ‘This Week’.
I wasnt off that trian because of USC and them winning or not, I barely watch college ball if at all, Im busy on Saturdays. I was off the tank train because the team made it very clear they werent going to do that when they didnt do anything at the deadline, so at that point I accepted what was going to happen. So you can kiss my ass in regards to that statement. Also I never once typed “‘No one called for Tanking for him ‘This Week’.” ever, or proof please.
Second, I never wished an injury on 8 but him getting hurt is the BEST thing that could have happened to this teams future. Dobbs isnt a long term answer but a QB with his poise and skill set is imo. So screen shot this comment for later if your going to continue to bitch about bitching. Your sass is getting old so put up or shut up about the accusations of goal post moving.
I really can’t remember who, but after the 1-4 start, someone said we wouldn’t win six games, should sit Kirk, play Hall and play for future.
I was on board with moving Kirk, never thought they would sit him so that wasnt me. I also said they would be lucky to win 5 or 6 games. The defense and Dobbs are factors I did not see coming, and proved me wrong.
I know you have your bias, Dobbs is playing great but so was Kirk the last several weeks. defense is a bit of surprise, but in all honesty, Atlanta, Bears, GB, Saints, aren’t the chiefs, Eagles, and Chargers( offense).
Schedule has helped some, we just have to do it after the bye.
Kirk was never worth what he has been paid, his extension hand cuffed this team and its chances to be legit contenders/ build a contender for the past 4 ish seasons and that this offense and franchise CAN win with out him or his supposed skill set. Rick and Zim shoulda been canned at the end of 2019, our Offensive line was better than people thought and was getting way too much grief and blame in the early losses. Vikings were right to move on the Kendricks and Thielen, and Cook. Those are just off the top of my head.
I can give you more I was WRONG about if that makes you feel better. Since im the focus of attention for folks here the past week for some reason.
Oh OK. I was thinking this year, and we’d be 6-4 right now whether Kirk got hurt or not. And either way, I like our chances the next three.
And I believe since you mention looking back at posts, I believe I said after Eagles game we were a better team than last year and would still make the playoffs.
That was a bold call. Lookin to be on track
Those are the last 3 big tests on the schedule imo and will dictate the out come of the season. Fun stuff.
Atlanta, GB, Saints – OK. Cincy, Lions, first rate offenses.
Atlanta is INEPT , their coach is God awful. Saints defense was a good test and really gives me hope for the offense. We will have to be in shoot outs at some point with those first rate offenses, will see what happens!
What Dobbs did against Atlanta was impressive considering the variables – new to the team, didn’t know plays, etc…
The win against the Saints did more to increase my confidence. That’s a good defense. Playmakers at all 3 levels of the defense and Dobbs made play after play. The lull in the 2nd half is concerning, but more a play calling issue imo.
He was one shoe string trip up from converting that 3rd down and kneeling out the clock, I think if that happens people dont react to that 2nd half as bad. He still made good plays in the 2nd half but the play calling was too submissive and I think KOC acknowledged that.
I wasn’t putting the 2nd half solely on Dobbs. He did short arm a throw to an open Hock that would’ve extended a drive but I agree it was KOC’s uninspired play calling in the 2nd half.
Yup, he did, thats one of those lay up throws you have to make and thats probably where his consistency is a factor that will hold him back.
Absolutely. But we’ve gotta stack wins until then. Can’t overlook anyone. Detroit games at end of year are huge. The last one is a prime candidate for the SNF finale.
Agreed, Denver is spicy right now, in their house, SNF…another big test, will see if we stack up. Peyton saves his tricks for the Vikings. If we do make the play offs I bet we play Detroit in WC game. So we would play them 3 times in less than a month
Yup. Denver week. Wife is a Broncos fan. She’s been talking shit all week.
Cant Wait!
I enjoy Denver in general but Wilson and Peyton being there really made me dislike them, so sorry to your wife, but I hope we curb stomp them on national TV
No apology necessary. I want that too. I’m diehard purple but I also rooted for Denver as a kid – Loved Elway & Steve Atwater, hated KC so me and Denver fans made natural allies. That all changed when they added Wilson and was further cemented by adding the Scab QB @ coach.
Liked the Broncos until they added Wilson and Peyton.
I only wish evil things for them until both those asshats are gone.
Bravo to you for admitting when wrong! And yes, he is a miracle worker! Hopefully he doesn’t leave after this year!
You hammering on something?
Using my persuasive gouger skills I got onto a new pheasant spot yesterday. Family tells me they got “a lot of birds, they need to be hunted down”. Wasn’t sure what to expect, pheasants haven’t been hunted on their land for years. If nothing else it is good exercise for the dogs…they had been out for nine miles (nine human miles, they cover much more) on Monday so I gave ’em a day of rest, took ’em out again yesterday.
I show up in the morning, their place is on the river, corn has recently been harvested, creek running down to the river choked with buffalo berry thickets, grass is calf high, I had planned on following the creek about two miles down to the river and then looping back along the river bank and coming back up another creek (but ended up cutting short as the dogs quickly became exhausted). I barely climb over the fence off the road to start walking the creek and the dogs break up a massive bunch of pheasants, like a deck of cards getting scattered on a table, I spot easily 100 roosters and as many hens plopping down all over the flat and benches. Was a beautiful day and the birds weren’t holding tight (like they would in snow) so mainly I just had fun working the dogs into one group after another. Got two roosters but the dogs flushed well over 200 pheasants, they were just going bananas non stop running from side to side of my cast.
I was keeping an eye on the young dog as it was his first hunt in this spot, didn’t want him losing his head and getting lost. Of course that meant the old choco disappeared, he was gone for about twenty minutes and came back covered in mud and burrs and walking like he had just been raped by a gorilla. That earned him a big ol’ spanking and a swim in the Yellowstone.
TL;DR easily the most pheasants I have ever seen in a day, and my dogs are walking like geriatric arthritics today
Put collars on, big country. So i heard.
Yeah, I have e-collars for them but never use them while hunting, worry they’re gonna get hung up on thorns in the thick berry thickets, plus I have to keep the transmitter somewhere on my person without losing it. Funnily enough I found a cell phone when I was scrambling through a thorny thicket yesterday.
They each have big bright orange neck bands and I use a whistle to move and retrieve them (one toot sit two toots hunt ’em up steady whistle get yer butt back here) and Tuck ignored the come back. I could see easily a half mile in all directions and he was nowhere to be seen…I kept working down to the river and used the whistle periodically so he could find his way back but he knew he done wrong, started quivering like a dog shitting razor blades when he was ten feet away but he still had to come to heel to get a spanking. Then he played the sympathy card to my wife, acted like his legs were all seized up when he got off his bed and I said it’s his own damn fault he should have stayed in the program. Dumbass.
Never owned a hunting dog, hunted with plenty. Frustrating when they get them up out of shotgun range.
It’s just a way of life, you can control them down so they stay tight but it takes a lot of training and makes them a little robotic. With two dogs I won’t win any competitions because they don’t know who I am commanding, plus they get competitive with each other trying to win praise. It is actually much easier when there is just a single pheasant in a 100 yard area because you can tell when they are homing in on the bird and can slow them up; there were just too many scent trails and birds everywhere yesterday. Now that I have a better grasp on the layout of that creek I can start being more methodical in the approach.
Get a pointer.
They even gave pointer labs.
Tuck is from pointing Lab stock and does a Lab point, but he is no pointing dog; before I had Labs I had vizslas and while not the king of pointers they did a good job. What you say makes sense, I had more birds flush in controlled (ie me walking up) circumstances with the v’s.
The pros of the Labs (little kids can maul ’em and they just eat it up, when muddy they enjoy getting sprayed off with a hose or jumping in the lake when it is skinning over with ice, don’t get cold on a nice blustery Montana December morning, will blast into thorny thickets with no care in the world, and most of all much much easier to train) outweigh the negatives for me, at least. I don’t need to limit out every time, mostly enjoy watching the dogs work and get exercise.
Growing up we had Britneys. High energy, smart pointers.
The ones we had were very sensitive. You yelled and they’d look ashamed.
I do a lot of duck hunting.
Pointer labs are the new doggos. Much more stubborn than a Britney, but an all around better dog.
If I just went upland, I’d consider a Britney again. But try and get one to go get a wounded goose in near freezing water.
I’ve got a pointing lab. He points well but doesn’t retrieve for shit and I somehow got a lab that doesn’t like to swim. He can and will, but not by his own choice.
That sucks. I’m one of 5 brothers. We have had a lot of labs and I can’t think of one that didn’t like the water.
Yeah, it’s weird because you couldn’t keep my last lab out of the water and she was a retrieving fool. This one is a good dog, listens and is good with my boys but a lab that isn’t obsessed with water is just weird. Good thing I didn’t pay much for him.
That’s about where I am with my choco, I am more of a waterfowler though. Dog gets 3 hots and a cot all year but he has to swim through slush water at 0degrees F for 6 weeks a year.
Buddy has owned short hairs all his life. The point is a distinct advantage.
Wow quite a score on the access. Do you use E collars, ever give pooches ASA?
They each get half a tablet of doggy ibuprofen (carprofen – Rimadyl) if they have had a particularly heavy hunt day after they have been sprayed off and fed. I find that helps a ton.
I use e-collars on my walks/hikes in case they get too curious in among the cows or horses, cuz cows and horses sometimes don’t appreciate they wanna be friends, and if they suddenly act porcupinish or skunkish. When I have the shotgun and they have their orange neck bands they know it is all business, deer and skunk and porcupine cease to exist, so I don’t use the e-collars.
True story: Camping on the shores of Tiber ~ 25 miles out of Shelby MT over Labor Day weekend 3 yrs ago. Not a tree in site. Lab goes down into small coullee comes out with snout full of porcupine quills. I can’t get the quills in his soft palette. Poor cell service call vet in Shelby no answer. 5 minutes later he calls back at 8:30 at night on holiday weekend and says meet him at vet clinic in Shelby. Gruff 70 yo guy who was a master at calming the dog and placing IV. Total bill $102, well worth it.
Yeah these small town vets are worth their weight in gold. Tuck got quilled a couple of years back and took it like a champ, I even pulled some out that were just barely showing above the skin of his muzzle with my teeth and pushed a couple through his cheek into the oral cavity so I could grab ’em with my hemostat. Soft palate yikes that would be impossible.
I’ve had to pull quills a few times out in the sage brush country. Quill pigs really like wheat fields. It is never fun and I’ve been lucky to be able to get all of them out on my own so far but I always carry a Leatherman when I go bird hunting for that reason. I hate porcupines.
Didn’t know porcupines liked wheat fields.
Yeah, at least around here. If you walk the brush around one you’ll find em and if you shine em at night they will be everywhere. We did some pretty serious damage to em after one got my dog in college by shining stubble fields in the area we bird hunted. I think we killed over 50 in a few nights.
Do they eat wheat spillage? I thought they just ruined trees.
Not sure, I just know I find them in the sage brush a lot and they will be out in the stubble at night.
Also, did you ask permission just prior to doing a Bx on the land owner while holding BIG stink’n needle?
Yes, that is the way.
Of course Kaepernick to Browns rumor, oh the drama. Brownies had Dobbs til Aug 24, dealt to Cards. Burrow rumored to have a brace on throwing hand. Like to watch game tonight but no can do.
Dudes closer to 40 than 30 and had ONE good rookie year before the league figured him out. When will that drama END?
It will end when the woke push everywhere ends.
Sooo, never?
Little spoken truth – Kaeperniick is not in the league because of his politics, but because he couldn’t throw an accurate ball from the pocket.
I thought he was out of the league because of his tan combined with the politics? I was told the league has colluded against him. If the Browns were to go that sort of route, I think they would call Cam first.
Exactly. I would bet a majority of players (especially black ones) hold his same view on the country and back him up, many other players kneeled as well, they arent out of the league, many still playing. If he was good enough to be a top half starter he wouldnt been signed many moons ago.
I would say mostly so, he was not a starting caliber QB due to his inability to throw accurately from the pocket, he is not in the NFL because its not worth it to deal with a constant distraction from a backup QB
Peter Schrager on GMFB this morning called out Cleveland a bit for not trying to get Dobbs back from Arizona knowing that Watson was nursing and injury that could easily get worse, which it did. Pointed out the Dobbs spent all of camp in Cleveland, was well liked and knew the playbook and system.
First, this is not a Cousins/Dobbs question but a QB question in general I find sort of difficult right now.
For me. I think Sean McVay is a really good offensive mind. Couple of years back, he found Goeff lacking (I guess), and went out gave up a load of picks and Goeff to get Stafford. Now, he could have gone out and gotten a lot of scrambling type QB’s for next to nothing but he didn’t. He could have opened up the playbook, been more creative, etc.but he seemed to pass on that.
And just slightly differently. Bucs had a SB team with a crappy QB. They went out and got Brady – actually Brady got them. but still, Aries is a pretty good offensive mind, and wasn’t interested, or at least didn’t seem interested, in other than a pocket guy. Brady is Brady of course, but wondering a little broader here.
So, when I read all the advantages the scrambler type QB offers, why go any other way?
Why would anyone draft a Burrows type QB?
IF the team has a very solid run game, a statue works fine at QB.
Provided said QB can move around a bit in the pocket when pressured. (Kirk cannot)
Stafford and Goff are actually very similar imo, with Goff being younger.
Goff has played better since the trade, and Stafford has fallen off a cliff after the SuperBowl run. The rams that year had a great defense and great running game.
Brady was all world.
Burrow can move in the pocket and even run if needed, you just do not see that happen often.
IF the only piece a team is missing is an accurate QB, that is when players like that get paid (Kirk 2018.
A mobile QB adds an entirely new dimension, even if they do not run, but only scramble when needed. Eventually the defense will need to put a spy on that QB, and that is one less defender in pass coverage.
I know you said it was not a Kirk/Dobbs question, but that is where I go.
A pocket passer is preferred by most teams, because the QB needs to distribute the ball well. That is job1..
A mobile QB adds another dimension. The unicorn is one that excels at both.
Boom! Well said….
Took the words out of my mouth, solid answer Surly. 100% this.
Someone should copy that and have it post with every article from this day forward.
Here here
Does Dobbs mobility make up for his average to below average arm strength and average to below average accuracy vs Kirk over a 17 + game season?
Put another way Passing velocity and accuracy Kirk > Dobbs, Mobility Dobbs>>Kirk
Is Kirk = Dobbs when averaged out???
Who says his accuracy is THAT much worse. His completion percentage has been pretty damn good since coming to the Vikings. I wouldnt use his stats with AZ because of the tire fire that whole staff/org is. The only thing he lacks that Kirk has over him his pure arm strength. Everything else as far as I can see as been at or better than what Kirk brings to the table. Including that thing between his ears.
Dobbs accuracy was 68% lifetime.
90% since joining Vikings according to Twitter.
And isnt that fairly average? 70% is considered Godlike or it use to be.
For 2023, Dak Prescott currently leads the NFL in completion rate at 70.7%. The median is around 66%. Dobbs is currently 24th in the league at 63.3% but that (obviously) includes his time at AZ. He’s been right around 67% in both games with the Vikings, which puts him in the top half of the league…good, not great.
And with what his legs bring to the game, I will gladly take good not great in regards to completion percentage. His weapons, the schema and KOC are helping him. And HE is helping the other weaknesses of the offense, theres a balance here that is really fun to watch.
70% isn’t godlike anymore, with the modern NFL rules anything under like 65% is below average. 70% is still really good but there will be several players that end the season at or above that mark.
As of right now, there are 3 QBs at or above 70%:
Dak 70.7%, and Josh Allen and Lamar Jackson both at 70.3%.
re you counting Josh Allen’s throws to the other team.
Accuracy is some advanced stat. It’s not the same as completion percentage.
I’m not exactly sure what site did it.
Right now, I’d say the mobility aspect tips the scale in his favor. I can’t believe how many sacks he’s escaped in 2 games (that Kirk would almost assuredly have taken) and moved the chains.
Proof will be discovered at the end of the season.
yes, Dobbs’ mobility makes up for his occasional accuracy issues and fumbles with small hands.
Guy is smart, and can be coached, and is an amazing athlete. There will be bad games, but there will also be games where his play is one of the main reasons for the win.
Dobbs > Kirk
With Kirk, you are not winning a championship unless every other aspect of the team is very good to great.
With Dobbs, he can make off script plays. That can and usually is the difference when playoffs start.
Here’s the thing… I think Dobbs mobility helps our run game. The defense has to respect Dobbs as a threat and a weapon which helps.
YES.
I noticed on a couple of plays that the Saints had a spy.
Not a very good spy if you noticed him narf narf narf
I don’t think Dobb’s accuracy is an issue at all – it’s good enough. But also, two of the last three SB winners, Stafford and Brady, aren’t mobile at all. So don’t know about that either. Offensive effeciiency is huge playoff time.
Agreed,
That TD to Hock just before halftime was a great example.
Hit him in stride, lofted it just over the LBs head, had defenders closing in on Hock from two sides.
Not a ‘prefect throw’ but it didn’t need to be. He did get it right where it needed to be from 30+yds away.
Dobbs accuracy as a Cardinal would put him at the bottom of the 33 listed starters on pro football reference.
Their stats are usually good. Phil liked them back when he was around.
If it’s good enough for Phil, it’s good enough for me.
fil liked them because he’s a lazy millennial and they had a really easy way of embedding stuff to post on DN
Well, I buy the unicorn. As Lee Trevino once said about golfers, the Lord doesn’t give anybody everything – Tiger was wild off the tee, Jack had no short game, Trevino couldn’t hit it high, etc.
Now, the “preferred” by most teams, I think is predictability. Scrambling may or may not be available, but a well designed play with a 20 yard cross to a good WR will be there and a QB is expected to hit i-t very- high percentage.
Oh, you mention statue and hate to get into Kirk debate – lost cause. But if your interested in a very unbiased QB takes, go look up Greg Cosell’s from I believe NFL films or something. He shows film and plays from a lot of different camera angles. He’s got one of our 49er game – no sacks. Watch the QB movement in the pocket.
The 49rs game was probably one of the best games of Kirk’s career. He played fantastic in that game.
I still feel that is an outlier for him. Pressure up the middle usually gets there. The O line played well and Kirk played at an all star level for sure.
I wish Kirk luck next year when he plays for the 49rs. it was a good audition tape for him,
I only made that point for one reason. Many times we watch on TV, but there are really a lot of film angles and reveal a very different picture. I’m not saying Kirk is a mobile QB, but far more moving around the pocket than many project – at least here.
Correct, if Kirk played like he did that game, 90% of the season every season, pay the man. He hasn’t, he didn’t and he won’t. Overall stats cover up the 1/3 of the season and play offs when he folds.
Dobbs play sustainable? What i read:
Throw to Addison with guts.
Pocket presence
Full field reads
Throwing on move
Creating outside structure
The end (running qb’s do take risks, however}
Black Case Keenum
Made me chuckle.
I still think both Hall and Dobbs are better than Keenum, and Mannion, and Mullens.
‘still think both Hall and Dobbs are better than Keenum, and Mannion, and Mullens…’
what about Hall & Oates?
You sound out of touch…….
What you did, I seen it…
Rec!
I watched an interview with one of them, I believe Darryl Hall. He said they never liked when people called them Hall and Oates. They specifically had their first names on every album trying to prevent that.
They’re all the same, except for Mannion, he’s absolutely the worst, and Hall doesn’t have the sample size, but yeah Dobbs, Keenum, Mullens basically the same person
Bald Case Keenum
Double B Keenum.
BBCK
Lmao
As with everything else Viking ‘I hope for the best but expect the worst’.
If Hall comes back then at least the most current ‘worst’ (Manniguin) will be sent back to the PS. Where he will stay for eternity hopefully.
Solid take.
Skolly wanted me to trade Tony Pollard to him in our league, tried to convince me one of his defenses would be worth it since our scoring and bonuses for Defenses in that league are out of control (defenses regularly score between 30- 50 pts its nuts). I said okay, Browns defense for an RB1. He said no, im riding out the browns you can have Jags or the Jets lol. Both of those teams have hard schedules and either way are not worth an RB1. My team has scored over 300 pts multiple times this season while streaming defenses. He’s lucked into a 8-2 record sneaking by everyone by 8-20 pts roughly in a high scoring league. I look forward to meeting him in the play offs and winning.
any fantasy football league where DEFENSE is king is a gross fantasy football league and really….a joke…
i have spoken.
They are and they arent. RBs and QBs actually are King as far as I can tell. Iv had good luck streaming ALL season but I was tempted just to keep Cleveland in my back pocket and im stacked at RB so I would be fine with out pollard but yeah…he’s overvaluing Ds and is taking up 3 roster spots with them, hoping it bites him in the ass.
‘he’s overvaluing Ds…’
classic Skolly
Just for fun I went and took a look at our league, you can pick up two defenses in FA right now that are better than Cleveland, I see you picked up Miami, that is a much smarter thing to do that trade with Skolly since they are a lot better than anything he’s got.
Thanks, I thought that was the smart move as well. Washington against NY was tempting but…that could be a fluke game were the Giants somehow have an offense, and I trust Miami more than a team that was selling their defense at the deadline
Gotta remember who the Gnats QB is now though too.
I’m streaming Washington this week.
There is zero point in trading for a defense in fantasy league, I dropped a top 5 defense on their bye week and picked up another top 5 defense to replace them. Skolly is kinda right that people don’t really pay attention to defenses the right way in fantasy, like just because a defense is actually good on the field doesn’t mean they are actually good at scoring fantasy points, in fact you’d be stupid to trade for Cleveland when they aren’t even in the top 10 for points in our league while like 5 top 10 teams are, he’s still delusional.
I am the b2b2b champion in our league (5x title winner, including a vampire season) and I ALWAYS stream a defense. We’re in Sleeper – THE KING OF ALL FANTASY APPS – and defenses also routinely score high. I’ll often not draft a kicker or defense and wait until the opener and then stream both all year.
What is “streaming defense?”
Just pick up the best defense each week based on matchups.
I have been too lazy to do that, and my FF record shows it.
What Surly said
It’s an oldie, but it still makes me chuckle.
classic staged video. but they can be fun to laugh.
wish this was real haha
You can find the real thing if you’re into that.
one PLUS about dobbs vs kirk, while dobbs is still not working on the full playbook, for obvious reasons (he’s not very smart), it also seems to have opened up KOC’s playbook…
specifically thinking of the direct snap to chandler.
perhaps since dobbs is more of an athletic style qb, the defense has to think about him A LITTLE bit, vs if kirk went out wide, the defense would be like NAHHH
also loved the run play that was a fake to…chandler maybe and dobbs ran it with chandler as his lead block, can’t run that with kirk.
You’re catching on Freezy. Agreed
i’ve never denied that kirk is not a mobile quarterback. it’s obvious there are play he can’t have called due to his inability to scramble run.
nothing to “catch on” about.
Any offense is more dynamic, dangerous and more affective with a QB that can navigate the pocket, and elude pressure. Not saying scramble first or lead the league in rushing (thats a bonus). Not a pocket statue, play has to be perfect to work QB.
Agree with all of this.
so if JJ says he is 100%, will the coaches believe him and let him play…..
or will they exercise the most extreme caution, sit him, give him another week via bye to FULLY FULLY heal, and then start against the bears monday night….
JJ is great. But given the last 5 games, do we need him to beat Denver. Getting him to 100% should be paramount.
i agree on this line of thinking…
but i also am not feeling as confident in this upcoming game, in denver, mile high, dobbs come to earth perhaps?
i definitely don’t view this as a “sure win”
There is no such thing as a ‘sure win’ with this Vikings team.
If you think that there is one that is the time Minn will lay an egg.
I think he sits until after the bye.
Week14.
i think this will happen as well..
i’d love to see him in Denver, but would prefer just getting another solid 2 weeks to get fully healthy
Think that’s a smart move.
Sam has this all wrong.
He needs to call Kirk’s agent and use this to get fully guaranteed deals, and win the support of the fanbase.
Lol at the Kirk stans still holding on down voting you. Notice how the fan base is less divisive and dicks to each other now that he’s out of the picture.. Im telling you Kirk being gone will be a blessing to the franchise in so many ways.
I’m anxious to see our offense once JJ is back on the field with Dobbs. Dobbs appears to spread the ball around more than Kirk did. Kirk missed open receivers because he was keyed in too much on JJ.
With JJ back, do you think we will see those deep 25 yard drag routes – a JJ specialty- when he returns?
Yeah. Dobbs can buy time for it to develop. I want to see some flea flickers, Cunningham to Moss style.
You think? Does Dobbs scramble to run or does he scramble to buy time and pass. Haven’t seen him enough to know. Mahomes does the later, a lot of scramblers do the former.
From what I have seen, it appears that Dobbs is looking to pass when he scrambles.
i did love that scramble pass to hock in the 2nd quarter.
That’s great. But the way he runs, and if does this well, it is stunning he hasn’t been a starter for the last 5 years in the league.
There’s been a ton of crappy QB play over this period.
i’m just going to keep my purple colored shades on and go with:
“he hasn’t been in the right spot for all those teams, crappy play and losses, BUT now he has found the right spot where he will finally shine and not play crappy/turnover prone ball and turn a corner, professionally”
Oh, all in to ride the wave and it may last a long time. Great. But perhaps just an age thing, if something seems to good to be true,…………
i know, which is why i’m skepitcal dobbs is “the guy” like some here think…
i would love to be wrong about that!!
He is for sure the guy for the rest of this year, as long as he stays healthy.
The off season ( the season the Vikings CAN win) will be more interesting than it has been since…. 2017/2018 with Kirk signing.
I hope they move on without Kirk, but whatever they do will impact this team for years.
True. He was drafted in Pittsburgh and sat behind Big Ben. The next year they drafted Mason Rudolph. Then he started bouncing around on practice squads and as a backup. His trajectory doesn’t bother me. Elite talent? Probably not, but a lot of QB’s have had long, rocky starts to their careers and turned out okay: Warner, Delhomme, Mark Rypien, Geno(?)
Dobbs does not have the accuracy or velocity of Kirk when throwing. He has remained a backup because of turnovers and some bad throws at times, and the teams he was on were not coached by KoC.
This team is still better with Dobbs at QB vs Kirk, and I will still say that if they lose to Denver this weekend.
Hock would have more receptions if Dobbs had more zip on the ball. I can think of 3 throws that Hock was wide open, but the DB got there in time because the throw was soft.
2 different examples of scrambling to throw against NOLA. One to Addison and another to Hock – both 1st downs. I’m not saying he’s Dan Marino in the pocket – but he ain’t Russell Wilson!
Don’t dispute that. But Wilson has been a starter in league for a long time and before last year most folks would have him in top 7 or so.
just saying, if a guy can scramble, throw while scrambling and throw from the pocket – he’s top ten in the league because their aren’t many that can do all that.
Yes, he does.
God that would amazing
I hope so.
And I hope more to see him complete a couple of those to JJ, and then pump fake one to JJ and hit someone else wide open on the other side of the field.
I am interested in this wrinkle, too.
I honestly could take JJ or leave him prior to the arrival of Dobbs. I didn’t care if they traded JJ, but now I am intrigued how he looks with a QB who can buy time in the pocket.
What if JJ is unable to improvise, when the play doesn’t go as planned? Will everyone criticize him like they do Cousins?
You know that wont be a thing lol. Its not like JJ didnt scramble in College with Joey Burr throwing to him. Hes just use to NOT doing it with old Statue boy under center.
He also was spazzy under any pressure, Dobbs is cool as ice and CAN evade and make plays if things totally break down. JJ in the mix will be fun
Maybe the down vote is because we are all tired of the comparison to Kirk on everything. If Kirk is not on the team next year DE’s post count will stay relatively low.
BTW I did not down vote his comment.
I disagree, his post count will be the same. He (and sometimes me) are feeling a little vindictive for being shit on on this form for calling out Kirks weaknesses and being labeled as doomers for two seasons, and now that its being shown that Kirk isnt needed to win we’re getting out words in edge wise. Once he is OFFICALLY gone, you wont hear a peep from me about him. Out of sign out of mind, im sure the same with DE.
I have no problem with anyone calling out anyone’s weaknesses, especially the highest paid player on the team.
But, it is getting to Kodiak levels lately.
When the guys who create the decisiveness complain about the decisiveness and then claim when what i bitch about is gone, there will be no divisiveness – well more than a little self serving.
More like one side finally being proven right and being “I told you so” about it, self serving indeed, It feels good.
Not anywhere close to DN Kodaik levels, that was peak
That is true, I just don’t like every conversation turning into a Kirk debate. It’s stale and hopefully at the end of the season we no longer have that issue.
It will no longer be an issue once the Vikings realize they are better off without Kirk
more than 4 seasons for me. Love this team.
Kirk is not the answer
Fly that flag proudly
*forum….
*sight….
Keep pushing, we may get to 420.
*our…
*OFFICIALLY….
Pretty good ad.
I dry brine for two days. then smoke at around 300.
Bird comes out perfect every time.
If only Kirk would follow this advice….
dead to me ☠️
First the Panthers, now Lipton. What a sell out.
…why not just use a pure sugar brine? Nasty ass Carolina recipe
If he was my realtor and he said something was gonna be easy, I would have to reply with “as easy as a 27 yard field goal? ”
LOL!
Oooof, I would use a fake name incase he’s buyers are NFL fans….
Yeah this was peak liberal agenda, I haven’t heard much on it in recently (thank God). Im sure its still alive and well on the coasts.
We get two hump days in a row?
GM
FTP
SKOL
Happy THORSDAY!
For MT….who is probably busy gouging people….
Thank you!
Good morning, SKOL!
FTP!
Happy second Hump Day!
Back to Back hump days.
great movie imo.